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	Comments on: Animal Welfare vs Animal Rights: An Important Distinction	</title>
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	<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/</link>
	<description>Truth About Fur Blog – Research, opinions and analysis</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 20 Apr 2024 12:37:01 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Shakey		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-36907</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Shakey]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Apr 2024 12:37:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-36907</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I can tell by some of these comments that, these people live on the 33rd floor of an apartment in a sprawling, ever expanding metropolis. Some may commute with EVs or Uber. They have no grasp on real life.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can tell by some of these comments that, these people live on the 33rd floor of an apartment in a sprawling, ever expanding metropolis. Some may commute with EVs or Uber. They have no grasp on real life.</p>
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		<title>
		By: John Nash		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-36699</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[John Nash]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Apr 2024 16:15:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-36699</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Humans live in a cave called civilisation in order to nurture our kind, safe from the mindless violence of nature.  Inside our human cave, we have human rules called ethics and morals. They in turn give us human rights because we are born in the human cave called civilisation. Rights are something we humans all own from birth.
Outside the cave, there are no morals, no ethics and no rights.  Animals kill and eat each other all day long as a normal part of their lives. If an antelope had rights, we would have to stop a lion killing it.  But that would take away the lion&#039;s rights. So, we give them back to the lion and take them from the antelope.  It is a silly game.  There are no rights in nature - that&#039;s why we invented civilisation, to protect us from the violence.
Welfare is something else.  It is something we humans can give to animals.  They are not born with it.  It is our gift to them.  If we are well-fed and protected, with a high standard of living, we tend to give them more welfare.  If we are hunter-gatherers and poor, we tend to give them less welfare because we need to use them for food and clothing. We all love animals whether we kill them or not. 
We humans give different welfare to different animals - a pet dog, a sheepdog, a cart horse, a chicken and a rat are all given different welfares - as companion, working dog, beast of burden, food and pest respectively.  It is not automatic, and none are born with rights. Our gift varies.
Our human cave needs resources and we take those resources from nature - animal, vegetable or mineral. Those resources have no rights - it is merely prudent not to use them all up.
Animals are simply a living resource that we use - we even kill them in order to grow vegetables or build cities or make smart phones.  We cannot avoid killing animals, so PETA&#039;s concept of never using them is simply weird, without any connection with reality. We humans have been predators for the whole of our history.
You are welcome to be a vegan or support PETA or any other belief - they are your beliefs, inside your head, not outside in nature, and I don&#039;t share them. Most of us don&#039;t in reality.
But you can have the luxury of these beliefs because you are a cave dweller, cut off from nature, and other people do your killing for you. 
 -]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Humans live in a cave called civilisation in order to nurture our kind, safe from the mindless violence of nature.  Inside our human cave, we have human rules called ethics and morals. They in turn give us human rights because we are born in the human cave called civilisation. Rights are something we humans all own from birth.<br />
Outside the cave, there are no morals, no ethics and no rights.  Animals kill and eat each other all day long as a normal part of their lives. If an antelope had rights, we would have to stop a lion killing it.  But that would take away the lion&#8217;s rights. So, we give them back to the lion and take them from the antelope.  It is a silly game.  There are no rights in nature &#8211; that&#8217;s why we invented civilisation, to protect us from the violence.<br />
Welfare is something else.  It is something we humans can give to animals.  They are not born with it.  It is our gift to them.  If we are well-fed and protected, with a high standard of living, we tend to give them more welfare.  If we are hunter-gatherers and poor, we tend to give them less welfare because we need to use them for food and clothing. We all love animals whether we kill them or not.<br />
We humans give different welfare to different animals &#8211; a pet dog, a sheepdog, a cart horse, a chicken and a rat are all given different welfares &#8211; as companion, working dog, beast of burden, food and pest respectively.  It is not automatic, and none are born with rights. Our gift varies.<br />
Our human cave needs resources and we take those resources from nature &#8211; animal, vegetable or mineral. Those resources have no rights &#8211; it is merely prudent not to use them all up.<br />
Animals are simply a living resource that we use &#8211; we even kill them in order to grow vegetables or build cities or make smart phones.  We cannot avoid killing animals, so PETA&#8217;s concept of never using them is simply weird, without any connection with reality. We humans have been predators for the whole of our history.<br />
You are welcome to be a vegan or support PETA or any other belief &#8211; they are your beliefs, inside your head, not outside in nature, and I don&#8217;t share them. Most of us don&#8217;t in reality.<br />
But you can have the luxury of these beliefs because you are a cave dweller, cut off from nature, and other people do your killing for you.<br />
 &#8211;</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sachin Raghavan		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-30751</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sachin Raghavan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Feb 2024 23:43:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-30751</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-10232&quot;&gt;Sam&lt;/a&gt;.

In an animal rights world the transition will be slow, anybody who works in animal agriculture will become crop farmers and help make plant protein crops accessable (all protein and essential nutrients exist in crops, fungi, and supplements, the latter is already used by vegans and non-vegans alike). Industries and economies always move on. The problem is that animal domestication and slaughter is already too normalized, with more vegans, less animals will be bred into literal industrial holocausts. Obviously select few groups in the third world and indigenous groups still need animal consumption for survival but this doesn&#039;t apply to the majority. We&#039;re morally obligated to live without consuming and killing them, there&#039;s no nice way to kill when we lack survival necessity for it. Animal welfare is inherently flawed because it allows these inherent cruelties while rights recognizes animal individuality and abolishes animal slaughter and their dependency on humans.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-10232">Sam</a>.</p>
<p>In an animal rights world the transition will be slow, anybody who works in animal agriculture will become crop farmers and help make plant protein crops accessable (all protein and essential nutrients exist in crops, fungi, and supplements, the latter is already used by vegans and non-vegans alike). Industries and economies always move on. The problem is that animal domestication and slaughter is already too normalized, with more vegans, less animals will be bred into literal industrial holocausts. Obviously select few groups in the third world and indigenous groups still need animal consumption for survival but this doesn&#8217;t apply to the majority. We&#8217;re morally obligated to live without consuming and killing them, there&#8217;s no nice way to kill when we lack survival necessity for it. Animal welfare is inherently flawed because it allows these inherent cruelties while rights recognizes animal individuality and abolishes animal slaughter and their dependency on humans.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sachin Raghavan		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-30748</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sachin Raghavan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Feb 2024 23:36:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-30748</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-1035&quot;&gt;Empathy Insteadof Killing&lt;/a&gt;.

Animal welfare tolerates inherent cruelties while animal rights abolishes these, rights are the only path.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-1035">Empathy Insteadof Killing</a>.</p>
<p>Animal welfare tolerates inherent cruelties while animal rights abolishes these, rights are the only path.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sachin Raghavan		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-20339</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sachin Raghavan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Oct 2023 16:41:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-20339</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-1844&quot;&gt;Tessa&lt;/a&gt;.

The title is a hint that they&#039;re funded by the fur industry, they have to lie their way through to keep their means of money intact.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-1844">Tessa</a>.</p>
<p>The title is a hint that they&#8217;re funded by the fur industry, they have to lie their way through to keep their means of money intact.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sachin Raghavan		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-19774</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sachin Raghavan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Oct 2023 04:47:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-19774</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-2185&quot;&gt;Faylinn&lt;/a&gt;.

Animal welfare doesn&#039;t consider animals as individuals, it objectifies them as accessories, tools, or goods. Animal rights is what rejects this concept.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-2185">Faylinn</a>.</p>
<p>Animal welfare doesn&#8217;t consider animals as individuals, it objectifies them as accessories, tools, or goods. Animal rights is what rejects this concept.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sachin Raghavan		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-19773</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sachin Raghavan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Oct 2023 04:45:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-19773</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-8749&quot;&gt;Truth About Fur, voice of the North American fur trade&lt;/a&gt;.

Pets don&#039;t choose to be domesticated, and people do use them as living accessories often in the same way people use slaves. It&#039;s not exactly the same but very similar. A lot of pets are neglected just cause people grow tired of them as if they&#039;re toys, or they&#039;re put to work such as being used by police and military. It&#039;s dangerous and stressful for them.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-8749">Truth About Fur, voice of the North American fur trade</a>.</p>
<p>Pets don&#8217;t choose to be domesticated, and people do use them as living accessories often in the same way people use slaves. It&#8217;s not exactly the same but very similar. A lot of pets are neglected just cause people grow tired of them as if they&#8217;re toys, or they&#8217;re put to work such as being used by police and military. It&#8217;s dangerous and stressful for them.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sachin Raghavan		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-19772</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sachin Raghavan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Oct 2023 04:43:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-19772</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-10231&quot;&gt;Nairu&lt;/a&gt;.

That&#039;s completely stupid and hypocritical, the people who kill some animals against people doing exactly what they do but to other animals. It&#039;s beyond brainless to fund conservation by hunting, it&#039;s no different than having a hitman kill someone and then the hitman gives the money to charity, all you do is trade one life for another.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-10231">Nairu</a>.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s completely stupid and hypocritical, the people who kill some animals against people doing exactly what they do but to other animals. It&#8217;s beyond brainless to fund conservation by hunting, it&#8217;s no different than having a hitman kill someone and then the hitman gives the money to charity, all you do is trade one life for another.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sachin Raghavan		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-19759</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sachin Raghavan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Oct 2023 02:26:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-19759</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-1649&quot;&gt;Truth About Fur, voice of the North American fur trade&lt;/a&gt;.

I can easily frame your logic by saying &quot;It&#039;s sad that you don&#039;t agree with serial killers. The debate over human rights and not killing humans is based on values, opinions, and shades of grey. It&#039;s sad that you must brand serial killers as biased, untruthful, or ignorant jsu because they don&#039;t agree with you.&quot;

There&#039;s no such thing as a right or freedom to oppress a sentient being, it contradicts the purpose of rights to begin with. You are correct in one aspect, morality is an opinion. It&#039;s based on the fact that sentient beings can suffer but whether or not it&#039;s right or wrong to kill a sentient being is an opinion that&#039;s universally agreed upon. If that can be agreed upon with humans it logically should for animals too. You can use any excuse that you use to justify killing animals to kill humans too, cause sentience and the capacity to feel pain is constant and unchanging for the most part. The vast majority of animals including the ones slaughtered for your precious fur are as intelligent as human children.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-1649">Truth About Fur, voice of the North American fur trade</a>.</p>
<p>I can easily frame your logic by saying &#8220;It&#8217;s sad that you don&#8217;t agree with serial killers. The debate over human rights and not killing humans is based on values, opinions, and shades of grey. It&#8217;s sad that you must brand serial killers as biased, untruthful, or ignorant jsu because they don&#8217;t agree with you.&#8221;</p>
<p>There&#8217;s no such thing as a right or freedom to oppress a sentient being, it contradicts the purpose of rights to begin with. You are correct in one aspect, morality is an opinion. It&#8217;s based on the fact that sentient beings can suffer but whether or not it&#8217;s right or wrong to kill a sentient being is an opinion that&#8217;s universally agreed upon. If that can be agreed upon with humans it logically should for animals too. You can use any excuse that you use to justify killing animals to kill humans too, cause sentience and the capacity to feel pain is constant and unchanging for the most part. The vast majority of animals including the ones slaughtered for your precious fur are as intelligent as human children.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sachin Raghavan		</title>
		<link>https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-19757</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sachin Raghavan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Oct 2023 02:21:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.truthaboutfur.com/blog/?p=6046#comment-19757</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-1859&quot;&gt;me&lt;/a&gt;.

Exactly, the website is made by people who profit off of animal products so they have to lie and cheat to give the impression that they&#039;re morally in the clear. You can see how much bias is in their diagram where they childishly mock animal rights and only have a one sided analysis.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.truthaboutfur.com/animal-welfare-animal-rights-distinction/#comment-1859">me</a>.</p>
<p>Exactly, the website is made by people who profit off of animal products so they have to lie and cheat to give the impression that they&#8217;re morally in the clear. You can see how much bias is in their diagram where they childishly mock animal rights and only have a one sided analysis.</p>
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